“>a series of posts at MLSTesseract to discuss this issue in more detail.
-Brian

I spoke with a client this past week who mentioned two homes he had driven by and I knew exactly which properties he was talking about, why they haven’t sold and what the issues are. Why? because I have shown over 200 homes this year.

That listing agent may know the neighborhood and the parks, when the swimming pool opens and when the neighborhood block party is, but really, do you think a buyer cares about those things? The listing agent also knows the sellers bottom line, and has a fiduciary relationship with that seller “first”.

Buyers want to know that I know my contracts, how to negotiate on their behalf and when to walk away, how taxes affect their offer and qualification ( a huge issue here in Indy). They want to know what the comps are and I have no reason NOT to show them all the comps; I don’t work for the seller. They need more info, I can get that for them. Above all, they want to know I am working for them.

Please don’t lump me in with “bad agents” because I use an indexable IDX – Just last week I had a sign call and sent the lead to an Associate. The lady who called me called another agent first, but he didn’t respond because the home he had listed was already sold. My associate sold the home and is listing the couple’s two homes. Indexable IDX or not, I work hard, not just for my clients, but also on my websites.

I think it’s worth noting that the entire issue stems from a complaint from another member of MIBOR. Not saying that either side is right or wrong, just that this issue was not a MIBOR vs agents ruling.

I do want to address this statement, because it is worth noting that the guy who reported me had no other motive except I have two sites; a blog and a website which were gaining on him in his #1 position. He was also doing the same thing with a blog and an RSS feed, which he will now have to take down.

While this issue may have started with another agent complaint, it has most definitely become a MIBOR vs. an agent issue. When they told me they would adopt the ruling as it was defined on Thursdays meeting at midyear, then fight it at the Board of Directors meeting on Saturday, they were fighting “me” alone.

Remember, this is not limited to only an indexable IDX; if you have a blog with an RSS feed of MLS data, you could very well be facing this same issue.

Am I upset; yes, but my intent was to notify tech savvy agents and webmasters who do not know what they are facing. Yes, I want resolution; apparently that will be a while down the road. In the meantime, I will be six months ahead of them on my blog and website.

Ann Hayman – That is certainly a concern and valid viewpoint.

My take is that the agent has to provide some sort of “inside scoop”, something the computer can’t tell me.

Of course! That is sales in a nut shell. I know that when someone calls your company and already has a good idea of what your product is, the sales rep on phone would never leave them with a “I will have to get back to you with that.”

In business there are two things to offer, products or services. A real estate agent offers both. Real Estate is the product, and their relationship with the client is the service. Most agents pride themselves on their service because their product is the exact same thing as every other agent.

So in that given scenario, the agent should be selling their services over the phone to the perspective buyer, not their product.

If the first step of converting a random lead into a real conversation is being taken by an agent who is less-than-well-equipped to convert the lead to an appointment (or whatever the next step is), then is that serving anyone?

I know from past sales jobs, someone who is less-than-well-equipped to convert a phone lead in to an sales appointment, doesn’t last long in the industry. I also know that if I were to call and agent and not be that impressed with the conversation, I would move on to the next one until I found an agent I bonded with and could trust to handle my negotiations.

So who does it serve? The next agent the consumer calls.

I think the most interesting point you raise is something I personally (this has nothing to do with the Realtor who emailed me) think is true:

With the tools now available online, I see the new generation of buyers being armed with absolutely a ton of information about the property/neighborhood before they ever speak to an agent. I see them hiring a buyers agent, to represent their interests in the negotiation of buying the property and not necessarily to educate them on the neighborhood/listing.

I happen to agree. Crikey, I worked at a company whose whole mission was to provide a ton of information about the neighborhood.

The issue, though, is IF the buyer already has a ton of information at their fingertips, when they DO call up an agent wanting more information on a property, what does the agent give them that the Great God Google could not? My take is that the agent has to provide some sort of “inside scoop”, something the computer can’t tell me. And that’s where the “I’ll research it and get back to you” might work, and it might not. If I called an agent inquiring about a house, and she responded, “I’ll have to investigate that and get back to you”… I’m not sure how much I’m going to want to talk to that agent again because as a consumer, I don’t know about IDX, I don’t know about market areas, and I don’t know about MLS coverage geographies. So all I know is that I called a “professional” who didn’t know more than I do, and didn’t seem to know her shit all that well.

I think Sue Adler’s point is worth addressing. It isn’t about getting someone to your site that ultimately matters — even to the seller. It’s about getting to a transaction. If the first step of converting a random lead into a real conversation is being taken by an agent who is less-than-well-equipped to convert the lead to an appointment (or whatever the next step is), then is that serving anyone?

On the other hand… maybe the issue is really a broader one — why there’s a gap between IDX and VOW data, for example. Why the listing agent wouldn’t enter enough info for any buyer-side rep to know “insider details” about the property, etc. I don’t know… Plus the whole dual agency issue… this little gem is a bit complicated more you delve into it.

-rsh

With the tools now available online, I see the new generation of buyers being armed with absolutely a ton of information about the property/neighborhood before they ever speak to an agent. I see them hiring a buyers agent, to represent their interests in the negotiation of buying the property and not necessarily to educate them on the neighborhood/listing.

I actually find it absurd to expect my agent (speaking as a buyer) to know everything about every property I am interested in. What I do expect, like any good agent in any industry (lawyers, entertainment and sports agents), is that they will properly educate themselves on the property before starting negotiation on my behalf.

A couple more points:

I hear a lot about the “crappy agent.” One that hurts the “image” of the real estate professional. I think this is an argument that holds true to every industry. I know in web design I look at hundreds of sites a day, and am naturally inclined to automatically judge that designer based off of that one design.

Yet I know that there are designs our company has pushed through that I am not going to go brag about. As I am pretty sure every agent has had a situation with a perspective client that doesn’t go as planned. Does that make you a crappy agent? Of course not, this is business. Not every arrangement you enter is going to be a successful one. This is natural. There is no such thing as a “crappy agent.”

Furthermore, I also know that not every joe smith agent can buy a website, feed google listings and rank in the top of the results. It just doesn’t work that way. So to be fearful that a “crappy agent” will out rank me in the search engines and feed the consumer false information about my property, to me is a bit absurd. Does it happen? Sure occasionally. But because of the times it does happen should we prevent agents from effectively marketing listings on line?

I was active in the comments and rallied to create a one sheet of talking points to keep everyone on the same page when speaking to MLS Committee members attending @midyear. However, I completely understand the other side of the argument. As said before by Matt, Tim, and Jeff – the data is out of the bag. R.com, Zillow, Trulia all have this data being indexed by Google. Allowing the Realtor membership the same rights only seems like it would give the public a better chance of finding a local expert instead of a national advertising company.

I believe Joe has a valid point that should be considered in this discussion. What if the data itself was required to include the listing agent’s name? or perhaps the listing broker’s website, or phone number? One slight tweak in the MLS rules of IDX changes the entire landscape of how the data can be used effectively.

I just don’t think preventing Google to index the data is a solution. If the anonymous contrarian really wants to make a difference, then push for changes in the requirement of what’s included in the data feed. Would Z, T, C, FD, or any other future aggregator exist if all MLS data was required to contain Broker, Broker Website, Agent Name? (this is not unlike the copyright issues of all media publishers on the web – the listing is after all the Listing Broker’s data)

I’m on the Associate Technology Council of Keller Williams, and one of the huge win-wins for agents and consumers has always been “my listings my leads” when it comes to internet or any other type of lead. Rob, I agree, the dual agency issue can arise here, but in truth, it rarely happens that someone actually buys the house they are calling on. ( let’s save that for another blog because I don’t want to lose my point )

Laurie Lister sells herself on the listing presentation to Sally Seller as the area expert and marketer – She knows about the elementary schools, how far it is from the train, that they have block parties and exactly which houses sold for what and when and can describe them all in detail.

She can also provide the prospects on her website with the floorplan, the virtual tour, a gazillion pictures, the survey, and way more than what appears on any idx. THESE are the reasons sellers trust their homes to a listing agent.

Sellers love that she advertises on Trulia, Zillow and Realtor.com, and even here, they have access to the listing agent for more information if the address comes up in a google search. ( Not sure if these are searchable but if they are, fine. It still has listing agent contact info and link)

Now from a buyer’s standpoint, when Bob Buyer googles Laurie Lister’s listing – the specific address or MLS number, Bob is looking for as much information as possible on that particular house and may even be looking for Laurie to find out these answers. Indexing this IDX info is very misleading to Bob because he thinks he’s getting the expert on this house, and it hurts Sally Seller because MLS areas are HUGE and what are the chances of that random techy agent knowing more than what Bob Buyer sees himself in that short IDX description?

I’m all for new tools and advancing technology but that isnt the point here. I don’t buy the arguement that all sellers will want this kind of exposure because they arent understanding what that really means as in the above scenario. Its one thing having regular IDX. Everyone has it. But it’s a whole other thing when a consumer googles an address, mls number, or even a listing agent’s name and having it show up on someone’s indexed IDX page over the listing agent’s. Its misleading to the consumer and unfair to the seller and the listing agent.

With IDX on every office’s site and most agents sites, consumers will find the houses they want, so let’s be honest – The people deriving the most benefit from the indexing are the agents who have it on their sites, not necessarily the consumers.